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09:30:46: <willvarfar> hello all
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10:56:43: <willvarfar> hello John
11:11:44: <impomatic> Hi Will :-)
11:11:48: <impomatic> How's it going?
11:12:09: <willvarfar> interesting times :) You?
11:12:32: <impomatic> It's hectic here at the moment!
11:12:35: <impomatic> WillVarfar: I'm organising a tournament for May if you're interested...
11:12:43: <willvarfar> tempted, actually :)
11:12:49: <willvarfar> just to make up the numbers
11:13:13: <willvarfar> I know how you love novel hw archs; heard of the Mill CPU?
11:15:24: <impomatic> Tournament will has prizes for 1st, 2nd and 3rd place. The source code for my vamp Nosferatu, a signed copy of "Life As It Could Be" by Thure Etzold and also a cash prize for first place :-)
11:15:40: <impomatic> Haven't heard of it. Googling now :-)
11:16:43: <willvarfar> its designed to beat x86 around the head
11:16:49: <willvarfar> its not a low-power low-end chip
11:17:10: <willvarfar> its a low-power high-end chip that eats general purpose code like goats eat trousers
11:17:46: <willvarfar> you can tell I'm enthusiastic; I'm a bit involved now; didn't design anything, all other people's genius, but I'm a mod on their forum and so on
11:17:56: <willvarfar> its right up your street
11:19:23: <impomatic> I need to look at it more closely after work. Where's the best place to get started?
11:20:57: <impomatic> "Life As It Could Be" is a novel which mentions Core War numerous times by the way. Even a few warriors are mentioned, Impfinity, Return of the Jedimp, etc :-)
11:22:42: * willvarfar googles the book
11:23:00: <willvarfar> http://ootbcomp.com/ is the Mill with talks
11:23:09: <impomatic> The tournament will be held at the Centre for Computing History in Cambridge :-)
11:23:18: <willvarfar> am writing the doc overview of it right now in fact
11:23:28: <willvarfar> ah, possible remote entries?
11:24:50: <impomatic> Yes, most entries are expected by email :-) Only a few people will attend.
11:26:25: <impomatic> By the way, I've found a few descriptions of Core War from before A K Dewdney made if popular :-) http://corewar.co.uk/earlycw.htm
11:27:35: <impomatic> I'm trying to piece together the early history of Core War at the moment.
11:30:53: <willvarfar> nice :)
11:34:06: <impomatic> John McCarthy wrote quite a bit about Core War (the same McCarthy who invented LISP)! He also invented vampires :-)
11:34:28: <impomatic> Although the first Redcode vampire was written by Uncle Bob Martin (of Agile fame)
11:34:54: <willvarfar> wow, really?
11:35:14: <willvarfar> crikey
11:36:48: <impomatic> I'm quite surprised as some of the things I've discovered. I've managed to track down quite a few people including David Jones and Aleph-Null :-)
11:37:23: <impomatic> But it seems the more people I talk to, the more I need to investigate...
11:39:40: <willvarfar> abstract question: done much vector stuff, e.g. simd?
11:40:16: <impomatic> Nothing :-(
11:40:38: <willvarfar> ah, so you wouldn't know what to call the size of a vector vs the size of each element in the vector?
11:41:39: <impomatic> No sorry.
11:42:38: <impomatic> I'll be buying a parallella to play with when they're available. Not simd though.
11:47:51: <willvarfar> yeap, I moved from parallella to mill
11:47:52: <willvarfar> :)
11:48:25: <willvarfar> next question: (I'm writing docs right now, trying to find words to describe things):
11:48:44: <willvarfar> if you do an op with a NaN, the result is always NaN.
11:49:00: <willvarfar> how would you describe it when some marker/flag does that?
11:49:10: <willvarfar> propagates? carries?
11:49:33: <willvarfar> the Mill CPU has other flags, like Not-a-Result (NaR) and None. So I want a general word to use.
11:50:30: <willvarfar> "NaR propagates; operations on NaR values always result in NaR."
11:50:37: <willvarfar> there must be a better word for this?
11:52:57: <willvarfar> I'm planning to make a Mill ASM code-golf game, which is not un-corewars-feeling
11:54:30: <impomatic> I don't know. Wikipedia uses propagate for NaN.
11:55:07: <willvarfar> but the spec doesn't. It says "if NaN particpates in an operation, the result is NaN" kind of thing.
11:55:14: <willvarfar> I can't find a word for it that I like.
11:55:25: <willvarfar> trumps seems wrong too. Viral? Hmm.
11:56:24: <impomatic> Have you seen BF Joust? It's played in Brainf*** on a short memory array. The idea is to capture the flag (find and set the opponent's flag to zero).
11:56:42: <willvarfar> I never have, no.
11:56:44: * willvarfar googles
11:57:11: <impomatic> I'm not suggestion you play (brainf*** is tedious), but it's an interesting idea for a programming game objective.
11:57:21: <willvarfar> yes
11:57:40: <impomatic> http://esolangs.org/wiki/BF_Joust
11:57:50: <willvarfar> mill can issue 33 ops/cycle, is fully vector, can be speculative, 1 cycle calls, etc. So its a monster.
11:58:16: <willvarfar> so the idea is that in the forum a special emulator for mill assembly, so people can actually run snippets they put in the forum
11:58:45: <willvarfar> and then discussion can evolve around things like how do task xyz in the fewest cycles
11:59:29: <willvarfar> simple stuff like strcpy is already 32 bytes / cycle and wc (word-count cmd-line app) is one byte / cycle
11:59:36: <willvarfar> so its a real cruncher
12:00:44: <impomatic> BF Joust has an IRC hill and is pretty competitive http://esolangs.org/wiki/BF_Joust_strategies
12:02:12: <willvarfar> joust really is cw like
12:02:14: <willvarfar> you play it?
12:03:29: <impomatic> I played it a few years ago. I don't particularly like studying other people's Brainf*** code though!
12:06:35: <impomatic> It sounds like I need a Mill CPU for Al Zimmermann's Programming Contests :-)
12:06:53: <impomatic> Time for lunch, back shortly...
12:08:22: <willvarfar> yeah, alzim said to hope for a new contest in may
12:44:21: <impomatic> The last one was too easy :-(
12:45:19: <willvarfar> or too hard
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